Lived Experience Forum

[CannonSalt]

When I have been in the grip of self-destructive urges to injure myself, I have talked myself out of it by speaking very harshly to myself - calling myself a baby, a coward, over-dramatic, etc. etc. etc.  It's my understanding that saying that kind of thing to someone else (also the classic, 'snap out of it') is completely inappropriate - but redirecting self-disgust at the self-destructive urges has historically been what helps me, when no amount of cute kitten photos has been able to. 

I'm beginning to think that depression just means you've got to do everything 'normal' people do (sorry, @NikNik , I know you've just lead a discussion about 'normal'...) but with a millstone around your neck.  Sometimes I'm able to tone it down to 'and what would self-harm accomplish?' or 'that won't actually help things'.  I don't really know what else to say, to me or to someone else - and I feel woefully underprepared.  Don't mind me, ruminating on something that is unlikely to happen.  What's a healthier way to talk about self-destructive impulses?

[NikNik]

Hi @CannonSalt

Your description of experiencing depression as '..you've got to do everything 'normal' people do but with a millstone around your neck' is such a great way to describe it - such strong imagery.

More broadly, self talk is an interesting concept to me. Some of us can be mean to ourselves and some can be kind.. and then there's a spectrum that can change at any point in time. We are never always kind to our selves, nor are we always mean/critical of ourselves - we're always changing.

Part of me wants to say to you 'whatever works, keep doing it' but I also wonder, even though that harsh self talk stops you SHing, could it be damaging you in other ways - self esteem and/or self worth. I don't know the answer to that.. I'm just putting it out there.

Have you tried Cognitive Behavioural Therapy? If so, I'd be keen to here how you found it.

[CannonSalt]

I can get pretty negative with my self-talk - positive, too, but I generally don't feel comfortable with accepting praise. Lots of other people can do what I do. I've been finding it useful to think of things like 'imagine you're giving advice to your best friend - would you talk to them like that?'

I have tried CBT, and I've found it confusing and frustrating - if I say 'I feel blah and I don't know why', I immediately get asked 'why is that???' and I feel like I'm playing madlibs with my motivations rather than doing anything useful. I feel like something's missing for me in CBT.

If someone, a friend or a kid came up to me and confided in me that they self-harmed, what is a good thing to say? (Beyond 'seek professional help' or 'talk to your parents').

[Former-Member]

This might not be the right thing to say but is Sh always self destructive ? It's not a great thing to do and I've worked hard on the self care stuff to try stop myself getting to those points where I feel the need to but it does actually help get through those awful points - and I can get some space and clarity to work out where next. But I'm also continuing to work on getting healthy enough to not get to that point.
Lj

[CannonSalt]

I guess I've always seen it talked about as a 'gateway drug', needing more and more in order to get the same 'high'.

I guess it'd also depend on the 'why' of self-harming as well. This NPR article interviews a person who self-harms and a psychologist - the article goes into a broad history of self-harm and some of the reasons why people have self-harmed. The person interviewed who self-harms is frank about their experience and specific about their methods, but the article didn't come off as gratuitious or sensationalistic to me (despite some dated terminology), and I found it helpful, if difficult to read.  It gave me the sense that I'm not alone in struggling with these issues.

[Former-Member]

I think people do it for different reasons... and the reasons can change. I know when I do it now, the reasons are quite different to what they were when I was a teenager. I also agree that the damage escalates over time. 

As for what to say to someone, I have no idea. I guess it depends on the context and what your relationship with them is...?

[Anna16]

I'm depressed and have major anxiety
..I'm new to the forum

[Appleblossom]

Welcome@Anna16

There are many threads you can join in on and feel free to tell your own story or ask questions.

The problem with repeated SH is serious.  Pain is supposed to send a cautionary signal to a healthy person to be aware ..or move away from danger ... etc  when that instinct is gone and pain becomes confused with pleasure or stimulation of a thrill or distraction ... then it is hard to make judgments about how much is enough.

My brother had so many horrendous deep and superficial scars all over his body ... inflicted over a 15 year period .. it accumulates and is best managed as quickly as possible.

My own self harm style ... was not intentional SH as I had spent the same 15 years trying to stop him from doing it ... so consciously I was against ... but unbeknownst to me I caused serious damage to skull and spine.  Only one time was blood actually shed in my case but my daughter saw it and it caused damage to our relationship ... we never had enough time together to explain it.  It was the last time I SHd and the police were called and told me I could have an aneurism ... I was strangely calmed by their matter of fact but concerned conversation ... then I drove myself and my mother to the psych ward ... but as usual ... I was sent away for being too sane ... though they did send the CAT team out later.

Please dont underestimate the damage SH can do to our sense of worth, physical body, credibility and relationships.

[Former-Member]

What scares me most is when it happens and you have no memory of it. If you're conscious of it then you can use techniques to delay or resist it but what can you do when you have no awareness of it, or conscious desire to do it, until after it's happened?

I hope it's okay to say this here. I feel like it's hijacking your thread a bit @CannonSalt - sorry. It's just something that's been bothering me more and more. None of the health professionals I have contact with seem to understand or know what to say about it. One hospital psychiatrist who i mentioned it to, said she didn't believe me. Nobody else has said that but neither have they given me any suggestions about how to prevent it, which makes me think that maybe they also don't believe me but don't want to say so. I swear I'm not making it up :-s

[Appleblossom]

That was an interesting article @CannonSaltreminding us that it is not just a modern phenomena but has been around for a long time. 

Yet my particular style was not about self mutilation and not even really intentional, though serious damage was done. 

I believe you @Former-Member I have never had any good discussions about it, the best have been the one's on this site and we almost had to plead for the right to discuss it.

I noticed that there is selfinjury.com

and SAFE alternatives that offers treatment. 

I like the acronym SAFE

Self Abuse Finally Ends